Problem with my Bernardet C50

[noplastik]

Hello !

Now i almost finished the restoration of my Berni C50 !
Some Parts are not original ( Tank is selfmade and Exhaust is from a D51 )
A Steeringlook and a Jaeger clock i found on the Market in Reimes

Today i have the maiden drive - cool feeling !

But i have a Problem - the Engine become very very hot - and after 10 min. of driving the Engine goes out .
After some minutes to cool down it starts immediatly .
It is no Problem of Ignition .
Ignition Time is 23° or 4mm and the Carb is a 18 Dellorto

Have anyone of you a idea why the engine became so hot ???

THX for help

Paolo Monti from Austria

[TONTONSCOOT]

WELCOME !!!
Very nice your Bernie !
the same model as mine !

Have you got the goods sparks ? I use Bosch W5AC, but Champion L45C are good too.
Does your "condensateur" (I don't know how translate...) are OK ?

This is mine :
http://www.les-tontons-scooteurs.com/fo ... 35&start=0

[noplastik]

Hello !
nice too , your Berni !

Yes i use a W5AC Spark Plug .
And the Condensateur is OK - because i don´t loose the Spark .
The carb become to hot - the Benzin in the Carb start to cooking ......
Is it Ok that the Fan ( Ventilation ) don´t blow - it work like Airsuck .

What do you mean ? Who many C 50 still exist ?

[TONTONSCOOT]

Did you rebuilt the ydral engine by yourself ?

[noplastik]

Yes ..
with New Bearing , Piston and clutch and it start on the first Kick .
The Gear work good and easy .

a other problem is the light - it is very low .

[CAMPARI]

Is the carburator main jet the good one ?

Some machine needs a special main jet during the "rodage" .

[jean-do]

hi paolo,
i think that your problems come with two directions .
first one and unchangeable, is that you ride a vintage french scooter !! so the cooling system is not at its best ....
the second possibility, is " vapor lock'" , cause by the heat of cylinder head, moving threw the pipe to the carb .
one solution is to create a small pad ( 0.8 to 1.5 mm thick ) in neutral material as celloron, asbestos (amiante ..oups i don't said it!) to cut the heat transfert between cylinder and carb . you can install too, a small aluminium sheet deflector ,on pipe's studs to move the heat flow away from carb ...
we would be happy to see you and your C50 in Lyon ,the 24-25 of april , for the Club Ydral France 20 th anniversary show !
see more infos on www.club-ydral.net

[noplastik]

the Main Jet is now a 82 . ( what is usual with the 18 Dellorto )
The aluminium sheet deflector is a good idea - even the "Thermo Spacer" between the Cylinder and the Carb
My Berni run between 70 and 75 Km/h ( and i have 120kg ! )
I was really surprised from the " Power "
But the scooter is very loud

lot of Questions - i know , but after 2 Jears of search i found out that your Forum ist the best help !

In the case of the 20th anniversary show from Club Ydral , i´m sorry it is a little bit to far
The Trip to Reims befor 2 Weeks was already " heavy " - 2000 km for only one Steeringlook ( i´m crazy ??? )

[jean-do]

No no no !!! just a real scooter fan !!as here we all are !

[TONTONSCOOT]

Un homme de goût, quoi !

[noplastik]

Un homme de goût, quoi !

You are rigth ! hehehe
I hope the google translator is OK

[noplastik]

Problem resolved !
Now it works - and the Engine/ Carb don´t get hot anymore .
3mm Gasket between Zylinder and Carb and a deflektor shied ( not professionel ) bring the result .

berni drive now fantastic !

Thx to all for help !

[jean-do]

ah ! here are good news !...
i'm not really sure that the cone on carb, gives you the best performance ?? a cone needs high speed air entrance to be effective , not really the Ydral use on a such heavy scooter....an orignal air filter ,with small depression cone inside the air filter would be much better, giving the ydral engine smoothness and much torque ...your cone is too close to the body propably creating bad waves in the air flow ???

[noplastik]

Yes you are right - but in comparison to the Gurtner carb - the Dellorto run better .
I can regulate the min. Gas - and the Berni runs a litle faster . ( and i have lot of different 5mm Main Jets for testing )
And it Start on the first Kick without using the Handlebar for Gas / throttle.
But i will test some other Airfilter ( i have some from Puch , Lohner and Lambretta ) first i have to made a adapter .
On the Gurtner i use a 75 Main Jet - on the Dellorto a 85 Mainjet .

this picture are from your Berni ? Is it a B49 ??
can you send me some Pics from Exhaust ? Please .

[TONTONSCOOT]

Could you tell me exactly whats your carburator Dellorto model ?
...And show us other picture of you and your Bernie ....

[noplastik]

it is a MA 18 B - i got him in Italy .
This type is very used on different Bikes in Italy .

[TONTONSCOOT]

Thanks, your Bernie is very nice !
What's your actual exhaust ?

[noplastik]

Thanks, your Bernie is very nice !
What's your actual exhaust ?

i think it is from a D51 - i got it in Lipsheim last Year ....

[TONTONSCOOT]

Have you got a picture of it ?

[noplastik]

Have you got a picture of it ?

sorry no pic- i can make one tomorrow - but it look like this one ....
( the Pic i found in the Web )

[TONTONSCOOT]

This one is a Gurtner R17D, and this scooter T2 IS MINE
... and this is the good exaust for a C50 / Y52 Bernardet !

There is (as I know) 3 kinds of exhausts availables for theses Ydral engine for Bernardet.
The 3 are OK.
For the C50, the exhaust is a little bit different

I think that your exaust is not a D51, but one of the 3 available for Ydral/Bernie

[noplastik]

This one is a Gurtner R17D, and this scooter T2 IS MINE
... and this is the good exaust for a C50 / Y52 Bernardet !

There is (as I know) 3 kinds of exhausts availables for theses Ydral engine for Bernardet.
The 3 are OK.

Realy its You ?!
Wow ist a small " Bernardet World "

I mean that it is not for the C 50 because the Mainstand don´t go 100% up .

i was the meaning that the right one is more flatt ...

[TONTONSCOOT]

Yes this is mine !
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3yYbRDz6tX0

This is the first bernardet i restored.
The C50 was the second
The Y52 "Paris Nice" was the third....


And I actually built/restore an other one.....very different

[TONTONSCOOT]

.... and i will make some pictures for you of my C50 exhaust .

[noplastik]

.... and i will make some pictures for you of my C50 exhaust .

OK ! You can be very lucky - 4 Bernis ! respect !

And there is no chance to get the flatt exhaust or a Tank ?
Did the C 50 have a Sidestand ?



And a nice Vid on Youtube !!!!!

[jean-do]

here are some pictures of my C50 exhaust system.




later this day ,i'll show you pictures of c 50 second series , same as Y52.

[TONTONSCOOT]

Paolo, does your carb is the same than this one ?

[chaud devant]

le carbu utilisé sur ce beau bernie est un carbu pour moto pas pour lambretta, facile a trouver en italie comme il l'a dit!! un ua ou ub fera tout aussi bien l'affaire (voir du coté cyclo sport ou petite cylindrée....
hi very nice restoration, nice to see a bernardet c50 we did not know.... it is a so cool scooter to ride!!!
where are you located?

[noplastik]

Paolo, does your carb is the same than this one ?

Not realy - mine look a litle different - during the next Days i will make some Piktures of it .

Thank you " Jean-do " for the Pic´s from your Exhaust .

@chaud devant - i´m from Austria and there are only 2 Berni`s - one in Vienna in a Museum and one is mine !
I agree 100% - it is a cool scooter - today i drove 14 KM .
The people in Town did look like i´m naked on scooter

The carb which i test on my Berni is a MA18B - it look like a Carb from a " Vespa VB1 150 or VL 150 "
And it is used on " MV Agusta Scooter " and other italian 125ccm Motobikes .

[SCOOTER DE BREST !]

l 'ideal est un montage d 'un carbu del'orto MAI18B3 (corps compact ,pas comme sur la photo, là 125 ld lambretta !)
Ces carbus fut installés sur les derniers Bernardet y 52 (1954/1955....)

[TONTONSCOOT]

Some pics of my C50 exaust (the same as Jean-Do):

[noplastik]

Thank you for the Pic´s .
I have a other exhaust and i will test it this weekend .
The airfilter i did changed ( from a MV Agusta ) but nothing is other .

I want to drive with my Berni on the " Gross Glockner " ( highest Mountain in Austria )
But i´m not sure if the Berni can do it ........

What is the right ingitionpoint for the Ydral engine ? 2 or 4,5 mm ?

[jean-do]

bitube engine is 5.5 mm before pmh

[jean-do]

you should become member of the Club YDRAL France !!!specialised in these engines . this year is the 20 th anniversary ...
contact :www.club-ydral.net

[noplastik]

you should become member of the Club YDRAL France !!!specialised in these engines . this year is the 20 th anniversary ...
contact :www.club-ydral.net

Wow ! 5.5mm !
it´s realy a lot - on Lohner or Puch it is only 2mm .

Unfortunatly i brocke one Pistonring - and i can not buy it in Austria
Because it is 54,5 x 3mm ....

I try to contact the Bernardet Club but they did not even answer .
In Reimes i spoke with someone of the Bernardet Club but till now no reaction .
Only in this Forum i got some informations - now i´m a little insecure .